About a month ago I decided I wanted to go back to the conceptart.org forums, because I thought this would be useful for me, to learn and get critique about my work (since I decided again that I thought concept- and game art was something interesting for me). I thought that forum was a motivational and useful place.
But it wasn't.
Already on the first day and one of my first post some guy (with apparently x years of experience which made him a sort of 'god' on the forums) came with a harsh and snarky comment, when I didn't even reacted on what he said in the first place. Since, you know, I came to learn that the internet is a place full of sensitive people and communication isn't all that perfect...so I try to be polite and friendly.
After I became a bit angry about it (it was really uncalled for), someone said I should just let it be. And I did, ...just after I came back there, I left again.
I thought I was the only one thinking that that forum is a bit of a harsh place, where people want to fight instead of just going to a process of learning and drawing together. To me, it's not a place where I can get motivated or get useful advice. I could learn yes, but to me...people that tell me 'I'm just not good enough', aren't constructive and useful at all. But apparently I'm not the only who thought it wasn't that of a nice place, I discovered someone else feeling the same and I guess there are more people alike.
Well, here's the thing: some people don't really think about how they can bring their message the best way, some people just spill it out the way they want it. And that's no problem, I mean, we're not always thinking of others, sometimes we have to think about ourselves (and especially on the internet it seems easy).
But when you're dealing with critique you should always be careful what to use and what not. Not every critique or advice might be useful for you. And sometimes it might not be useful at all. Some people might like environments where people are brutally and honest and say "this sucks", but in my opinion, it would be better if someone said "this sucks, but you know it could look better if you gave more attention to this and this part". And then there are people who are really sensitive about their art, even when they want to learn and get critique, who rather appreciate it if you use the sandwich method of also pointing out the good things...for some people that works best.
In the end I think as an artist or illustrator you learn to deal with all sorts of critique and advice, seeing as that I got already lessons by very different teachers. So I think that the best way to deal with it is to filter it out, take what you think is useful to you, and always try to see it positive: you could learn from this. It might help to write out the things that you think are useful and let the rest be (but at least think about it). And if you don't really understand what someone is saying, just try to ask (politely) what they meant with that.
And then again: don't be afraid to ask for critique and advice, ...you can learn from it and become a better artist as well as a better person. You know...especially when you're being a starter you should remember that you're not perfect, you are still learning. And that's ok. It's ok to make mistakes, because you learn from that, so don't be afraid to just keep on going!
Thanks for sharing this Petra! I'm sorry you had such a terrible experience over there. I can understand what you mean about constructive criticism – and it used to be that when people had nothing nice to say, better to stay quiet. Now it's just a free-for-all where people just make snarky comments and "I'm better than you" hand-waving.
ReplyDeleteThere are the exceptions of course, but I find that there's so much to learn from both parties if done in a constructive way. I'm learning so much from the people who are taking my classes – I'm humbled everyday.
Keep on going! :)
Thanks Amy,
Deleteyeah well the internet is a public place of free speak, but I guess some people just forget that there are actual humans behind those posts and computers.
There are a lot of good and nice places too I think though, I should remember that!
Interesting. Talking about constructive comments -I liked your work very much, regardless the technique (especially drawings like the "Scary" sketch ), because I feel a sense of search and meanning, a substract as a basis- or at least an intention or inclination for the ideas behind the old drawing curtain, to reach this kind of merit. In neoplathonical speech, the intuition for a lengauge the represent archetipical subjects.
ReplyDeleteDo not bother with the internet forums. By definition, the digital medium is the stage of anonymity, which pass thousands of rats gnawing everything in sight - and dogs barking at everyone who passes in front of the gate. The exchange of ideas among illustrators is another beach, far from it.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Walter :) really appreciate it!
DeleteDid you have any good experience with getting constructive critique somewhere on the internet? I mean, it can't be all that bad... I often read about people that have their own e-mail criticism group or a facebook group or whatever, but the ones I can find are huge. That's another thing that doesn't help I think, though you'll probably have a bigger chance of any comment/critique at all.
You want me to be honest? painfully honest?
ReplyDeleteThe multitude of professional (or supposedly professional) has offered me in mutual relations,
scattered references - and somewhat opportunistic. The great conversations I've had, have been with those consolidated and well known professionals - beyond the issues of building a career - that because they are in a position that they doesn't need to prove anything to anyone, have an analytical sense very timely, objective and refreshing. My major experience is with art direction and screenwriting (I have talked to many people really famous, and artists of undeniable quality, thanks to the positive side of the Internet) and I can say that in general, the Great Learning lives in the observation of professional attitude and the lives of great artists (and his culture). In fact, to use a metaphor, nowadays I'm more interested to read interviews with writers - or artists (good writers) than to read his books.
I'm editing a book about the art of the movie we just finished filming in May. This unveiled a series of advanced topics that I tell you, based on our observation of other books about movies (Ghibli, Fox, Weta ...) and I mention here without making any value judgment and has a perfect analogy with the production of illustrations in all senses:
- The books lie and omit, because they do not really want to teach the tricks of the producer.
- The construction and explanation of the final option (of a character, prop and set design) is much more important than the sketch.
- Quantification and variations on a theme is a key factor. The result of an element after 10 or 100 studies is obviously different.
- Research is often a factor today, paradoxically, it has never been easier. Research is the key. Otherwise, you end up drawing aircraft of World War I flying as Star Wars spacecraft, drawing dinosaurs with four fingers or making props of the Roman Empire based on elements of the Italian Renaissance.
- In the end, the technique does not matter. (Wow!)